Ryzen

LunarMist

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What's the deal? Are too many of the cores defective, not cooperating or maybe a gravity wave or earthquake?
 

sechs

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The same chiplets are used in Ryzen, Threadripper, and Epyc. I think that demand is just much, much higher than expected.

Considering TSMC's recent announcement concerning lead times on new chips, AMD could be in a crunch.
 

LunarMist

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For all we know the CPUs may pass into the 6th dimension of vorpware due to the "shortages." :alien:
 

LunarMist

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Not really. I suppose now it would be best to wait and see how many GHz can be produced with their HEDT CPUs that have a good number of PICe lanes. I keep thinking about that Windows 10 and will need it sooner rather than later.
 

Stereodude

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Not really. I suppose now it would be best to wait and see how many GHz can be produced with their HEDT CPUs that have a good number of PICe lanes. I keep thinking about that Windows 10 and will need it sooner rather than later.
I'm less concerned about raw gHz than I am actual performance. Chasing ultra-high gHz just burns power and clobbers efficiency.
 

LunarMist

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Is there any expectation that the cores of the future HEDT CPUs are individually better than the 3900x cores?
 

Stereodude

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Is there any expectation that the cores of the future HEDT CPUs are individually better than the 3900x cores?
How far into the future are you considering? Intel is claiming a big IPC gain with their latest cores that would make them roughly on par with the Zen 2 cores (for IPC), but so far those are all on Intel's 10nm which clocks slower than their 14nm process (so far).
 

sechs

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I get the (unfounded) feeling that Threadripper will get better chiplets. The AM4 parts with two chiplets have a good one and a not as good one.

I think that Intel has spun out on HEDT. All they can do is push clocks at 14nm and hope that their 10nm chips can catch up. I don't think that they're even bothering with a new chipset for the next round.
 

LunarMist

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How far into the future are you considering? Intel is claiming a big IPC gain with their latest cores that would make them roughly on par with the Zen 2 cores (for IPC), but so far those are all on Intel's 10nm which clocks slower than their 14nm process (so far).
My time is running out. I cannot get the Sony software to run (though it supposedly does work in Win 7) and I'm sure that Nikon and Canon updates will no longer support 7 RSN.
 

LunarMist

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Both the AMD and Intel mainstream CPUs are crippled in the number of PCIe lanes.
The new Intel Cascade Latex looks like a half-assed upgrade from the 9900x series.
 

Stereodude

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Doesn't AMD already offer more than 18 cores for less than $1000?
Not with Zen 2 cores, at least not yet. They'll have 16 for $749 once they launch the 3950X. The next gen Zen 2 based Threadripper looks like it may start at 24 cores. No idea if they would price that at $999 or there will be variants with less than 24 cores that they could put at that price point.
 

LunarMist

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Not with Zen 2 cores, at least not yet. They'll have 16 for $749 once they launch the 3950X. The next gen Zen 2 based Threadripper looks like it may start at 24 cores. No idea if they would price that at $999 or there will be variants with less than 24 cores that they could put at that price point.
I would hope that some users want PCIe lanes and don't need 24 cores, but if there is a cheaply made CPU, then all bots are off.
 

LunarMist

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Well, Intel isn't doing it with Ice Lake, either.

Threadripper 1000 and 2000 chips have a much more compelling price/performance.
I think it depends more on the specific worker and percentage of time saved with a better CPU.
You must take into account the level or workers using them, e.g., GS6, GS9, GS12, higher? What are the fully burdened costs?
 

Newtun

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Isn't that defective CPU creating a a major security risk?
I'm not sure what you mean, but there can't be too much of a risk if you can't boot your Ryzen 3000 PC :). (Apparently, this bug has been around for months [and somewhere I read that it's been years, but I'm not sure of that].)
ExtremeTech.com said:
Destiny 2 Doesn't Currently Run on Ryzen 3000 CPUs, but a ...
"AMD has identified the issue impacting the ability to run Destiny 2 on Ryzen 3000 processors and have implemented a BIOS fix that has been distributed to partners. - Jul 12, 2019"​
Aside from that issue with Destiny, it seems that Linux uses RDRAND in its boot-up cycle, maybe for virtual-memory address conflict avoidance or similar.​
Editing to add some new references (The Linux problem seems to be in systemd, "the systemd "System and Service Manager", an init system used to bootstrap user space and manage user processes. - Wikipedia"):
 
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LunarMist

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I thought the random number was important for encryption functions. The defective CPUs produce a fixed "random" number.
 

Newtun

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Well, that would increase the pressure on AMD to correct the problem.

Apparently, AMD has provided a fix to motherboard manufacturers, for them to include in their BIOS updates. IIRC, this would correct the microcode on the Ryzen CPU itself, to make RDRAND produce varying "random" numbers, instead of the same 0xFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF value every time it's called.

I think I saw some software fixes for the issue for Destiny 2 and systemd, but I'm not sure of the status of the systemd updates in the various Linux distros, and of course, those would only be "work-arounds" for the hardware problem.
 

LunarMist

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It reminds me of a defective CPU in the 1990s that had some calculation errors.

How do normal Windows users (not Linulux or game players) know if it works of not?
 

LunarMist

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There is quite a gap between the 105W 3950X and 280W 3960X. 280W is too much power just to get a decent number of PCIe lanes. :(
 

Stereodude

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There is quite a gap between the 105W 3950X and 280W 3960X. 280W is too much power just to get a decent number of PCIe lanes. :(
Who cares? Your power company will sell you the extra power you "need". Additionally, I still don't know why so you're hung up on PCIe lanes that you seem to have no need for.
 

LunarMist

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The tower is normally only a half meter away from me, so heat is an issue especially in the summer. :(
The electric company congratulated me for using significantly more power last year than similar homes. ;)
 

Stereodude

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The tower is normally only a half meter away from me, so heat is an issue especially in the summer. :(
Well, they are more efficient than Intel. Their TDP ratings are also more honest. So a comparable HEDT Intel solution will use even more power under load and have worse performance.

The electric company congratulated me for using significantly more power last year than similar homes. ;)
So you should be used to it.
 
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