A question for all....

Do you approve of a married person having an affair?

  • I approve unconditionally.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Under certain circumstances, I would approve.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No, I do not approve under any circumstances.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0

flagreen

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Do you approve of a married person to have an affair?

By affair, I mean as defined below in definition number 3.

"Main Entry: af·fair
Pronunciation: &-'fAr, -'fer
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English & Middle French; Middle English affair, from Middle French, from a faire to do
Date: 14th century
1 a plural : commercial, professional, public, or personal business b : MATTER, CONCERN
2 : a procedure, action, or occasion only vaguely specified; also : an object or collection of objects only vaguely specified <their house was a 2-story affair>
3 also af·faire a : a romantic or passionate attachment typically of limited duration : LIAISON 2b b : a matter occasioning public anxiety, controversy, or scandal : CASE"


No need to post a reply. Just vote without comment if you wish.
 

Mercutio

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I think in a strong marriage an affair is absolutely unforgivable, given the notion of fidelity that is typically included in marriage. However, I can also see circumstances where an affair might be forgivable, or unavoidable.

I think the greater crime than the sexual aspect of an affair is the emotional one. I think it's possible to enjoy the former without the latter, but when one's feelings for one's paramour equal those for one's partner, THAT is the day wrongdoing has truly occurred.
 

Clocker

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If you are going to have an affair, get a divorce first.
 

jtr1962

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No, it is inexcusable, period. In fact, I consider it unacceptable to cheat in a long-term relationship even if you're not married(since we felines can't legally get married I have to feel this way 8) ). Anyone unhappy in a marriage should get a divorce first. I think there's so many extramarital affairs these days because people want to have their cake and eat it too, meaning having all the advantages and trappings of being married with the freedom of being single. As to why so many people feel the need to cheat, I would say because they simply settled for the wrong partner because they were afraid of being alone.
 

Buck

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I could never approve of an affair, it is unacceptable, dishonest, selfish, and disobedient to an agreement you entered when accepting your wedding vows. If an affair occurred, and your mate is truly repentant, I can see the possibility of forgiveness – although that particular marriage arrangement will never be the same, and the re-establishment of trust will be hard earned.
 

Dozer

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Buck said:
I could never approve of an affair, it is unacceptable, dishonest, selfish, and disobedient to an agreement you entered when accepting your wedding vows. If an affair occurred, and your mate is truly repentant, I can see the possibility of forgiveness – although that particular marriage arrangement will never be the same, and the re-establishment of trust will be hard earned.

Several years ago, I was on the receiving end of an affair (my ex-wife met a local man in a chat room called "married and flirting.") I completely disapprove of it (albeit I am biased) on the grounds that it is destructive not only to the relationship, but also emotionally destructive to the person that was cheated on. I am a generally strong person emotionally, without any emotional problems to speak of. My attitude towards life is positive and I enjoy my life. But during that period of time I experienced some the single most depressive, dark, and utterly hopeless moments I have ever lived through. It was incredibly destructive to my self-esteem, and it affected every part of my life, from work to my other interpersonal relationships. It has taken a couple of years to finally get back to my old happy-go-lucky state of mind, and I thank God that I was able to return to that state, because I know many people that never recover. Let me just say that if you are considering or are involved in an affair, think carefully about the person you are being unfaithful to...the potential damage is more than anybody should have to bear.
 

P5-133XL

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Affairs do not have to break vows, be hidden, or even break anyones trust. There are reasons for marriage that may not include love or even closeness. The classic example would be Kings and Queens that marry for reasons of state and have lovers on the side to satisfy the emotional side. for this example, the affairs are open aboveboard, harms neither party, helps everyone cope and are a good thing. I'm sorry but in my view there are rare exceptions to the harm that happens to most that have affairs.

With the above said, for the vast majority affairs are an unacceptable breaking of the trust within marriage. Invariably the affair is simply a symptom of a marriage that has or is breaking down.
 

P5-133XL

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Affairs do not have to break vows, be hidden, or even break anyones trust. There are reasons for marriage that may not include love or even closeness. The classic example would be Kings and Queens that marry for reasons of state and have lovers on the side to satisfy the emotional side. for this example, the affairs are open aboveboard, harms neither party, helps everyone cope and are a good thing. I'm sorry but in my view there are rare exceptions to the harm that happens to most that have affairs.

With the above said, for the vast majority affairs are an unacceptable breaking of the trust within marriage. Invariably the affair is simply a symptom of a marriage that has or is breaking down.
 

Mercutio

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In a situation like mine - where my partner came to me and said "I need to find out if I'm gay", I could hardly fault her for finding what she needed to know. A case, surely, where an affair is forgivable (to me, anyway).

Marriage is a very special bond, surely, but it is a bond that can be easily broken. Treat it for what it is, a spiderweb chain between two people, exactly as strong as each person sees it. The only people that need know, or to approve or to forgive an affair, are all those involved.

Is there any more that can be said?
 

jtr1962

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P5-133XL said:
Affairs do not have to break vows, be hidden, or even break anyones trust. There are reasons for marriage that may not include love or even closeness. The classic example would be Kings and Queens that marry for reasons of state and have lovers on the side to satisfy the emotional side. for this example, the affairs are open aboveboard, harms neither party, helps everyone cope and are a good thing. I'm sorry but in my view there are rare exceptions to the harm that happens to most that have affairs.

I believe most people here assumed that the question was asked in the context of non-arranged marriages and non-consensual affairs. In the very limited circumstances you mention, an affair is acceptable, even desirable, in order to ensure the emotional health of the King/Queen.

However, marriages of convenience are very rare nowadays, and arranged marriages are getting less and less common, even in places where they were the rule. I think affairs were tolerated a bit more when arranged marriages were common, especially among the upper classes. Mistresses and concubines were fairly common in those times, and were usually openly discussed. It is only in modern times that affairs have taken on an almost universally negative connotation, largely because there is no reason to marry anyone you don't love nowadays, and thus no valid reason to cheat. And if you don't love each other any more, no reason not to get a divorce before you cheat.
 

Mercutio

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I actually know someone facing an arranged marriage right now. She's Indian, but her parents are Southern Baptist and trying to keep within their homeland's tradition. There are exactly six people in the US they'll allow her to marry (nationality/income level/religion etc)
Understand, this is a comfortably middle-class, American girl. But if she says "no" to arranged marriage, she also loses her family for the rest of her life. Tough call.

Arranged marriages do still happen.
 

CougTek

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Mercutio said:
I actually know someone facing an arranged marriage right now. She's Indian, but her parents are Southern Baptist and trying to keep within their homeland's tradition. There are exactly six people in the US they'll allow her to marry (nationality/income level/religion etc)
Understand, this is a comfortably middle-class, American girl. But if she says "no" to arranged marriage, she also loses her family for the rest of her life. Tough call.
That's something I have a hard time with. If they moved to America, they should behave like Americans. I think this is great opportunity for her to show that she's American and not Indian. Would it be me, the family would get my big broad middle finger pointed high and firmly in front of them.

America is supposed to be the land of freedom. If you have something against freedom, you have no business here, return to where you are from (and should remain until you change your mind about the way you want to live). Arranged weddings aren't something I associate with freedom.
 

Handruin

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CougTek said:
Mercutio said:
I actually know someone facing an arranged marriage right now. She's Indian, but her parents are Southern Baptist and trying to keep within their homeland's tradition. There are exactly six people in the US they'll allow her to marry (nationality/income level/religion etc)
Understand, this is a comfortably middle-class, American girl. But if she says "no" to arranged marriage, she also loses her family for the rest of her life. Tough call.
That's something I have a hard time with. If they moved to America, they should behave like Americans. I think this is great opportunity for her to show that she's American and not Indian. Would it be me, the family would get my big broad middle finger pointed high and firmly in front of them.

America is supposed to be the land of freedom. If you have something against freedom, you have no business here, return to where you are from (and should remain until you change your mind about the way you want to live). Arranged weddings aren't something I associate with freedom.

I was thinking the same thing about the middle finger. If I had to choose a life of untruthful love with someone I am stuck with, or the choice to be free and on my own to make my own decision, I would walk away and present the big broad middle finger.
 

P5-133XL

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Oh, I don't disagree that arranged marriages are not very common and state marriages are very rare. I was merely giving an example of the classic case.

If you want another that I think is actually more common, try this -- A marriage, with children, that is breaking apart and the two partners decide mutually that breaking the family up is unacceptable. The solution is to stay together, for the sake of the children, and have affairs to satisfy that specific need. Again, both are up front about it - No lying, no breaking of trust, the family situation stabilizes. The situation is not Ideal but it may be for the best for everyone concerned.

Another scenario is the Mormon polygamy method of a single "official" marriage with an extended family of unofficial wives (affairs?).

The point I wish to make is that as long as everything is open and accepted by all concerned parties then I don't see the wrongness. It is the hiding, the jealousy/possessiveness and the broken trust that is wrong and causes the harm


PS sorry for the previous double post. I think SF was intermittantly down when I pressed the post button. When it did not respond, pressed it again.
 

P5-133XL

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CougTek said:
America is supposed to be the land of freedom. If you have something against freedom, you have no business here, return to where you are from (and should remain until you change your mind about the way you want to live). Arranged weddings aren't something I associate with freedom.

Sorry to disagree but people that come to the west do not disgard their previous culture immediately and they should not wait to come until after they have been westernized. We must be tolerant of their differences and accept them for who and what they are. Let them keep their culture and add it to our own within the limits of what we can tolerate as a society. It hurts us little to be tolerant of such differences and improves us greatly.

We are the Borg of the human race.
 

Tea

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Don't worry about your double post, Mark. Just ask one of the mods to cross your name out on the second one and write my name on it instead. That's almost exactly what I would say.

I believe that in a marriage, unconditional faithfulness is an essential. Not a desirable thing, not a good thing, an essential thing. With that, you have a relationship of worth. Without it, you don't. Period.

(Tea? Did you just say "period"?)

(Why yes, Tannin. I did say "period".)

(That's not English, Tea, it's American. Why on earth can't you say "full stop"; it's a much less unlovely term.)

(Because, Tannin, unlike you, I think communicating clearly with my friends is more important than linguistic purity. Most of the participants in this thread are Americans, ergo I should write in American. If I were writing to you, or James, or Prof. Wizard or anyone else that speaks in English, I would say "full stop" instead. And if I were writing to Coug, not knowing which of the two is correct, I would say either "période" or "point" as the mood took me.)

Hmm... I don't like it.)

(Fine. So bugger off and let me make my own post in my own way.)

Sorry about that, guys. Tannin is getting more and more human-minded every day. As I was saying ...

But to understand my point we must have a clear idea of exactly what I mean by "unconditional faithfulness". I do not mean "sleeping with no other". In many cases, physical fidelity is considered to be a part of what I mean, but in other cases it is not. It all depends.

By "unconditional fidelity", I mean that one hasat all times unquestioned respect for one's partner. Let's say that you and I got married, Tannin. Just imagining, I mean. I would expect you to always be considerate of me. I would expect that you would make your very best effort to see things from my point of view, to understand and respect my opinions and my feelings, to never, ever knowingly do anything to degrade me or devalue me.

I would not expect you to think about me all the time, or spend all your time with me, or never spend time with anyone else. In fact if you came to me and said that you were having a romantic relationship with someone else, I would trust that you had made damn sure in your own heart that this relationship was no threat to our relationship, merely an adjunct to it. On the other hand, if I thought that you, like so many husbands, thought that you can think anything you like about me when I'm not there just so long as you didn't engage in any horizontal gymnastics outside the marriage, I'd file for divorce that same day.

You see, the thing that matters is not who you sleep with. It is what you think of and feel about your partner. What you do with that pretty young chimp down the road is your business, not mine. And hers, of course. I'd far, far rather that you had a wild, romantic fling with her, meanwhile retaining your love and respect for me all the while, than that you said or thought bad things about me but kept your hands off her lush black fur.

Hey - she's intelligent, charming and rather pretty. Why not? (Well, pretty for a chimp, anyway. Not as pretty as me, of course.) If you want to stray in that direction, just so long as you still love me and respect me all the while, that's fine. Of course, I expect you to treat her with a similar respect. But you would, otherwise you'd not be the man I married. And she better be nice to you too, or I'll stroll down the way and rip her pretty little arms off.

Right. Now that you've mentally finished with the entree in this fantasy within a fantasy within the mind of a creature who is herself mere imagination ... let's get down to the real thing. Me!
 

time

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He did it. He finally did it. He married off two of his sock puppets, albeit as a hypothetical exercise in the imagination of one of them. I think.

Pray that we never get to a wedding night.
 

CougTek

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P5-133XL said:
Sorry to disagree but people that come to the west do not disgard their previous culture immediately and they should not wait to come until after they have been westernized. We must be tolerant of their differences and accept them for who and what they are. Let them keep their culture and add it to our own within the limits of what we can tolerate as a society. It hurts us little to be tolerant of such differences and improves us greatly.
Our views differ on that matter Mark, but since I don't want to high-jack this thread, I'll continue the discussion about this latter in a more appropriate place. For now, I'll just say that it's ok to be tolerant up to a point, but being overly tolerant only leads to the lost of your own cultural identity. Being part of a "nation" a lot smaller than your United States, I can assure you I know what I'm talking about.
 

P5-133XL

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Tea said:
Right. Now that you've mentally finished with the entree in this fantasy within a fantasy within the mind of a creature who is herself mere imagination ... let's get down to the real thing. Me!

I doubt that the creature is herself mere imagination. To make her seem more alive, I believe that real hands and socks are involved and are actually necessary.
 
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