Arrrgh! My main system appers to be crapping out. Half of the time the video will not engage and the screen is gone. I removed the video and reinserted it. but now it blacked out again. It has also locked up a couple for times for no reason. Is it possibly the card or more likely the mainboard? Thanks.
problem Dying Computer
- Thread starter LunarMist
- Start date
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
Do you have a spare graphic card and a spare monitor? Otherwise, it will be difficult to diagnose for sure. Regarding the possibility of the mainboard, you could stream audio and wait for the next video outage. If the audio keeps playing when the screen blacks out, then it's probably not the mainboard.
No, I don't really have any other cards to use. The monitor is dying, but that is not the issue. It works well enough with the other computers.
The audio test is a good idea. I'll try it over the next day.
It played the same song all night and was fine in the morning. Then I rebooted a couple times and the display was black again. I bought some cheapo single-slot video card for $48. It's OK so far, but installs software. WTF is the GFExperience?
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
All you need to install is the graphic card driver. The HDMI audio driver too. You can leave all the rest. This is only a test graphic card so don't bother too much.
GForce Experience is useful if you play games and want a tool to remind you when there are driver updates. It does a few other useful things (Shadow Play) if you want to record your desktop and/or game into a video. They do make updates regularly to the drivers. Like Coug mentioned, you can skip this if you don't want it.
Thanks. The computer won't boot now, or at least there is no display.
I'm screwed now.
Now it is rebooting, but continues to crash. It could be bad RAM, but even with only two stcks it still craps out.
I was already planning to build a new system, but now perhaps I need two as this dead one was going to be the second system.
What CPU would be good for the second system, the 4790K?
Stereodude
Not really a
Why don't you get that one working again?
My suggestions is to take it all apart, backup your data with another PC, vacuum / blow it out, and re-seat / re-assemble it starting with the bare minimum. CPU, one stick of RAM, use the integrated graphics (if it has it) otherwise the low power graphics card ,and one drive. See if it will post, boot, and run reliably with some sort of stress test on the CPU / RAM. If not, your pool of suspect components is much smaller. If it works fine gradually build it back up until the bad behavior starts.
My suggestions is to take it all apart, backup your data with another PC, vacuum / blow it out, and re-seat / re-assemble it starting with the bare minimum. CPU, one stick of RAM, use the integrated graphics (if it has it) otherwise the low power graphics card ,and one drive. See if it will post, boot, and run reliably with some sort of stress test on the CPU / RAM. If not, your pool of suspect components is much smaller. If it works fine gradually build it back up until the bad behavior starts.
So far I'm very happy with my 4790K. It should make for a great second system but don't use the stock HSF though. I'm finding I can't do tasks that use 100% for long periods of time before the CPU gets into the high 80C range. I ordered a new HSF but it never shipped so I canceled and ordered a temporary one until I can get what I want. At least upgrade it to the coolermaster hyper evo 212 or something nicer if you want to overclock it more.
I tried three groups of two different RAM modules with no luck. I reset the BISO to default parameters as well with no luck. It frequently freezes, BSODs, sometimes hard drives are missing at BIOS boot, etc. Other times it boots, then reboots several times before completely powering off. Everything has been working fine for nearly 4 years until I returned from XMAS. In my limited experience the motherboards go bad after some years, but I'm not sure. It might be worth replacing the motherboard if anything still exists for the i7-980X. In any event, I will build the 5930K system as I have been meaning to upgrade for a long time.
You'll get better performance from a 4790K than spending cash on a used motherboard for the 980X. See if you can sell the 980X to someone rather than throw it away. You can get a 4790K from microcenter for $250 and a decent motherboard for about $100->$150. What speed is your RAM? The 4790K uses faster RAM (DDR3-1600) than a stock 980X (DDR-1066) would have back in its day.
Thanks. The ram was DDR XMS3 1600 Corsair. 6x4GB was pricey back then. If it will at least run OK I can consider other RAM later.
Microcenter is less than 50 miles. Is there any particular motherboard you'd recommend around $150?
Microcenter is less than 50 miles. Is there any particular motherboard you'd recommend around $150?
Without knowing your requirements for things like board size (atx/matx/eatx, etc) overclocking, SATA ports, PCIe config, USB port counts. Here's some suggestions. Maybe others could also give their thoughts. Is this just temporary or will you run this for a long time?
Core i7 4790K @ Microcenter $280 (I have to check but I thought I paid $250 just a couple weeks ago...it's $340 @ newegg)
Gigabyte
GIGABYTE GA-Z97X-UD3H-BK $150
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SLI $124
Gigabyte GA-Z97-HD3 $107
If I were picking a little outside the range as my primary system, I'd pick one of these two from Gigabyte:
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H $184
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SOC FORCE $194
ASRock
ASRock Z97 Extreme6 LGA 1150 $165
ASRock Z97 EXTREME4 $139
Asus
Asus MAXIMUS VII HERO $210 (This is the one I went with, but got it for $179 at microcenter)
Core i7 4790K @ Microcenter $280 (I have to check but I thought I paid $250 just a couple weeks ago...it's $340 @ newegg)
Gigabyte
GIGABYTE GA-Z97X-UD3H-BK $150
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SLI $124
Gigabyte GA-Z97-HD3 $107
If I were picking a little outside the range as my primary system, I'd pick one of these two from Gigabyte:
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD5H $184
Gigabyte GA-Z97X-SOC FORCE $194
ASRock
ASRock Z97 Extreme6 LGA 1150 $165
ASRock Z97 EXTREME4 $139
Asus
Asus MAXIMUS VII HERO $210 (This is the one I went with, but got it for $179 at microcenter)
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
Of Handruin's list, pick the ASRock Z97 Extreme6 motherboard. It has a 3rd Gen x4 M.2 slot, so you'll be able to put a Samsung SM951 SSD at full speed when they'll be available.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
1366 motherboards are UNBELIEVABLY primitive by current standards. It was always a niche interface and those boards were only made for, what? 24 months? With zero consumer refreshes and maybe one Server/Workstation lineup refresh.
If you're even thinking about going back for another round of 1366 (and I say that because I have a bunch of them), here's what I can say:
Asus boards, whether consumer or Workstation models, lose BIOS settings at the drop of a hat. BIOS defaults on ALL of them are IDE mode SATA and Virtualization and Legacy USB turned off. On the up side, they'll boot with 8GB DIMMs installed, but for some reason POST takes a super-long time if you have more than 24GB. They're also weirdly picky about booting off USB devices.
Gigabyte X58 boards need BIOS updates from a DOS boot floppy or CD. They absolutely will not boot with 8GB DIMMs installed, so far as I can tell.
Dell workstation-class boards (from Precision or high-end Optiplex machines) will work with any mix and match combination of RAM as long as it's not more than 24GB.
And if you get in to the usual server-class suspects, good luck finding the ~30 specific four year old buffered/ECC whatever DIMMs that are actually on the HCL for whichever board you pick.
I might've had some experience dealing with this over the last several months. I wouldn't recommend it for someone who actually has money to spend on this stuff.
If you're even thinking about going back for another round of 1366 (and I say that because I have a bunch of them), here's what I can say:
Asus boards, whether consumer or Workstation models, lose BIOS settings at the drop of a hat. BIOS defaults on ALL of them are IDE mode SATA and Virtualization and Legacy USB turned off. On the up side, they'll boot with 8GB DIMMs installed, but for some reason POST takes a super-long time if you have more than 24GB. They're also weirdly picky about booting off USB devices.
Gigabyte X58 boards need BIOS updates from a DOS boot floppy or CD. They absolutely will not boot with 8GB DIMMs installed, so far as I can tell.
Dell workstation-class boards (from Precision or high-end Optiplex machines) will work with any mix and match combination of RAM as long as it's not more than 24GB.
And if you get in to the usual server-class suspects, good luck finding the ~30 specific four year old buffered/ECC whatever DIMMs that are actually on the HCL for whichever board you pick.
I might've had some experience dealing with this over the last several months. I wouldn't recommend it for someone who actually has money to spend on this stuff.
Thanks, I've binned that idea. So now I have some kind of basic 4790K system sitting on top of a case and running OK. I forgot that CPU had built-in video which is nice.
It is using a mid-sized HSF they had at the store, but is not so good at 4.4GHz and full load. I'm using some ancient RAM from the 980X system for now.
I also have ordered all the parts for the 5930K, but the UPS and Fedex are not being good for me this week. So far I have received some RAM, a PSU, and the giant Noctuate HSF that looks like the radiator for a Buick or something.
If the 5930K works out, the 4790K will be a secondary system, and not used very much anyway.
time
Storage? I am Storage!
Is it just me, or is the 4790K likely to out-perform a 5930K in almost all desktop applications? And that's before any over-clocking ...
I guess it can support double the RAM - if you're prepared to quadruple how much you spend on RAM.
CougTek, Intel CPUs/chipsets don't have enough PCI-e lanes to go around as it is. And it's hard to see x4 M.2 devices with useful capacity becoming affordable for some years - certainly beyond how long Lunar is likely to keep a PC.
I guess it can support double the RAM - if you're prepared to quadruple how much you spend on RAM.
CougTek, Intel CPUs/chipsets don't have enough PCI-e lanes to go around as it is. And it's hard to see x4 M.2 devices with useful capacity becoming affordable for some years - certainly beyond how long Lunar is likely to keep a PC.
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
Time, the x4 M.2 slot on the ASRock Extreme6 uses PCI-E lanes from the x16 PCI-E slot, dropping that one to x8 when used. I doubt Lunar is a hard core gamer, so I don't think it would affect him much.
Also, the price I've seen for the Samsung SM951 is around 750U$ for the 512GB model, which isn't that bad considering the speed. Yes, there are 1TB SSD available for that price, but they aren't that fast. It depends what he wants.
It's cheaper and faster than a Samsung 845DC Pro, which isn't quite as fast, for instance.
Also, the price I've seen for the Samsung SM951 is around 750U$ for the 512GB model, which isn't that bad considering the speed. Yes, there are 1TB SSD available for that price, but they aren't that fast. It depends what he wants.
It's cheaper and faster than a Samsung 845DC Pro, which isn't quite as fast, for instance.
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
They're neck and neck for desktop applications, but Lunar's specific needs are almost all content creation-related. That stuff eats extra cores and better memory bandwidth for breakfast. The pricing difference on DDR4 will go away soon enough. There's definitely a case to be made for the less expensive option, but in all the years we've known LM I don't think he's ever been one to worry about his budget for these things.
With any luck I will find out this weekend. I suppose it depends if 4.4Ghz is feasible with the 5930K.
It's not difficult to keep all 8 threads of the 4790K busy most of the time, so I'm hoping 12 can help. Even if the 5930K is only 25% faster, it will be worthwhile as I don't upgrade very often.
Well, I completely screwed up this one. :carp:
ddrueding
Fixture
Reset the BIOS and remove the fish.
Now I'm on the old XP system.
The MSI X99s board doesn't seem to have any method to overclock. The CPU speed and BCLK are always auto.
I updated the BIOS and donwloaded the latest drivers. The 4790K is much faster than this POS 5930K setup.
Although I installed every USB driver in the world, only 2 of the 8 USB 3.0 ports work.
Are there any other X99 boards that have a halfway normal BIOS and a full-speed M.2 slot? I'll probably go Cougtek-ish on this one.
I was avoiding Gigabyte, because the last three boards all died after 2-4 years, but at this point I've already sunk enough money into the CPU, RAM, HSF and case to try.
Thanks.
The MSI X99s board doesn't seem to have any method to overclock. The CPU speed and BCLK are always auto.
I updated the BIOS and donwloaded the latest drivers. The 4790K is much faster than this POS 5930K setup.
Although I installed every USB driver in the world, only 2 of the 8 USB 3.0 ports work.
Are there any other X99 boards that have a halfway normal BIOS and a full-speed M.2 slot? I'll probably go Cougtek-ish on this one.
I was avoiding Gigabyte, because the last three boards all died after 2-4 years, but at this point I've already sunk enough money into the CPU, RAM, HSF and case to try.
Thanks.
ddrueding
Fixture
As stated previously, I'm 100% happy with the ASUS options. The X99 Deluxe I have at home has one M2 port on the motherboard and includes a PCIe card that will hold another one. It has tons of overclocking features (that I've only dabbled in) and everything has just worked in Win8.1.
CougTek
Hairy Aussie
ASRock X99 Extreme4. 231$ at NewEgg. x4 PCI-E M.2 slot. Looks decent. Neither MSI nor Gigabyte. Worth a shot IMO.
I 100% agree with this ASRock X99 Extreme 4. If you want a trouble-free and solid board, this is the X99 board to go with right now until all the others sort out their crap. If you read the reviews and feedback everywhere complains of all kinds of problems with X99 boards and BIOS instabilities from the major manufacturers.
Thanks. Do you think there would be enough room for the Noctuate HSF next to the first 16x slot?
I'm not sure what to do about a graphics card. What's the best fanless one?
Depends which Noctua you bought. Not likely if it's the Noctua D15. I believe that one intrudes on the first PCIe slot. Their website lists motherboard compatibility if you want a definite source on that.
Yes. Same physical layout of mounting holes.
I started all over on the 5930K setup and after a while somehow got everything working, even all 8 of the rear panel and the 4 USB 3.0 port headers used for the front panel.
It can be clocked to 4.5GHz, but is unstable after that and I'm not going crazy on the voltages.
I ran the LinusPack burning test for Intel and there were no errors after ~18000 seconds.
Max temp was in the low 70s, so I think the Noctual is doing well enough. Everything is in a new case now and there is enough room around the giant HSF.
There are two 120mm intake fans that cool hard drives, one 200mm intake fan on the side (over the PCIe slots), and one 120mm exhaust fan.
There are mounts for 1-2 exhaust fans on top of the case. Should I install perhaps one exhaust fan or is it better without one?
It can be clocked to 4.5GHz, but is unstable after that and I'm not going crazy on the voltages.
I ran the LinusPack burning test for Intel and there were no errors after ~18000 seconds.
Max temp was in the low 70s, so I think the Noctual is doing well enough. Everything is in a new case now and there is enough room around the giant HSF.
There are two 120mm intake fans that cool hard drives, one 200mm intake fan on the side (over the PCIe slots), and one 120mm exhaust fan.
There are mounts for 1-2 exhaust fans on top of the case. Should I install perhaps one exhaust fan or is it better without one?
Mercutio
Fatwah on Western Digital
I left mine without, though I wasn't terribly aggressive with overclocking. My 5930k is in an NZXT Source 220, which is pretty well ventilated all by itself.
ddrueding
Fixture
I'm always a fan of positive-pressure cases. Prioritize intakes, particularly if they are filtered.
So far I'm not seeing much difference in some apps; certainly the gain is clearly less than +50% from the hexacore CPU. Some are maybe 1/3 faster.
I have noticed that it is possible to throw multiple instances of some apps at it and the speed barely slows down, whereas the 4790K is nearly half speed for each.
I suppose the CPUs are similar enough that the single threaded parts run at about the same speed.