Ebay sniping service suggestions?

[Stereodude]

I'm going out of the country to the other side of the world next week and won't necessarily have internet access at the right times, or won't be up at the right times to snipe myself, and I'm not a fan of bidding before the end and giving others a chance to react to my bid.

So, does anyone have a free (or really cheap) sniping service they recommend for ebay?

[Howell]

I'm pretty cheap.

[Stereodude]

Is that what your wife told you? :D

[P5-133XL]

I've used Auction stealer (http://www.auctionstealer.com/home.cfm) successfully for years.

[Stereodude]

I'm trying out Gixen (http://www.gixen.com/). We'll see how it goes.

[sechs]

Try bidding in a principled manner, instead.

[Howell]

I'm trying out Gixen (http://www.gixen.com/). We'll see how it goes.

It worked OK for me.

[ddrueding]

Try bidding in a principled manner, instead.

Only worth considering if everyone else plays nice as well. These services exist, therefore the rules have changed. Not using them isn't principled, it's handicapped.

[P5-133XL]

I must be dense because I just plain don't see what is wrong or unethical with using such a tools. The person that bids highest always wins the auction regardless of the use of sniping tools. Anyone that wants too can bid whatever they want and the upper limit of the bid is hidden till it has been exceeded by someone else, regardless of the use of the tool.

[Stereodude]

Try bidding in a principled manner, instead.Uh, no thanks. Sniping gives the bidder (me) an advantage, so why wouldn't I use it?

[Stereodude]

It worked OK for me.It's been working just fine for me, though I've yet to win anything using it. I guess I'm too much of a cheap bastard. :lol:

[udaman]

Uh, no thanks. Sniping gives the bidder (me) an advantage, so why wouldn't I use it?

Too bad none of these web based sniping services work on anything other than ebay and a few other auction sites. Would be nice if they worked for any url you enter...then I might win some wines @online auctions. Only problem is now many an auction site uses extended 2min or 5min bidding from the last bid when the lot is scheduled to close to bids. I've seen bidding go on for upwards of a hour, and hammer price double/triple or more than official 'ending' time. That's a much longer period than normal in-person type auctions. People go insane on those.

http://www.forbes.com/forbes-life-magazine/2009/0427/051-lifestyle-auction-wine-spirits.html

2 bottles of '59 DP Rose set record of $84k when two 'anon' phone bidders go at it for 6+min

But then, lol a single bottle of '59 DP Rose 'passed' with a estimate of $10-18k back late last year at the low of the wine auction market...damn, missed a 'deal' :).

http://www.zachys.com/auctions/SearchResults.aspx?AuctionId=53


See, was hoping to use such a sniping service on one of the $5 reserves for 'great' wines they have every other week on winebid.com

http://www.winebid.com/buy_wine/spotlight_results.aspx?SpotlightId=2096

though some of those wines remained unsold for the starting bid the week before, once they get that $5 reserve thing going, many of them sell for *more* than the high estimate...sure are a lot of dumb people bidding (with more money than brains).

[Fushigi]

My solution is easy: avoid eBay altogether.

[Howell]

It's been working just fine for me, though I've yet to win anything using it. I guess I'm too much of a cheap bastard. :lol:

The irony is that the service is most effective for buyers when the value of the object is not well defined. I ended up using the service to win something for $64 that I valued at $80. The was a lot of sniping going on at the end; maybe 4 bids in the last 30 sec that I could catch.

In the end I think it puts some power back in the hands of the bidders by taking some of the emotion out of the purchase. The downside is that the seller does not benefit from a frenzy.

I also think that Ebay actively allows the practice thereby relieving me of a conflict of principles. It would be easy for them to not allow bidding or bidding by API in the last say 10 sec.

[Howell]

Is that what your wife told you? :D

She wasn't the first or will be the last. : )

[Stereodude]

The irony is that the service is most effective for buyers when the value of the object is not well defined. I ended up using the service to win something for $64 that I valued at $80. The was a lot of sniping going on at the end; maybe 4 bids in the last 30 sec that I could catch.I'm not so sure about it being the most effective for objects whose value is not well defined. I think it's most effective for items that don't have a lot of bids. Frankly I like sniping because it eliminates the ability of any other bidders to react to my bid. If I bid $150 early for something on I give everyone a chance to feel me out. They can either decide they are willing to pay more and increase their own bids which does nothing for me but push up the price I end up paying (assuming I still win it).

In the end I think it puts some power back in the hands of the bidders by taking some of the emotion out of the purchase. The downside is that the seller does not benefit from a frenzy.I'm pretty much immune to getting emotional about ebay purchases, so that's not a big concern to me, but as I mentioned before I like keeping my cards close to the chest until the very end.

[Stereodude]

My solution is easy: avoid eBay altogether.Well, for buying some used stuff it's the place to go. For example with used camera equipment you'll get a far better deal on ebay than you will from KEH.

[Howell]

I also think that Ebay actively allows the practice thereby relieving me of a conflict of principles. It would be easy for them to not allow bidding or bidding by API in the last say 10 sec.

Actually, I think it would be constructive for Ebay to disallow new bidders in the last hour.

[P5-133XL]

Actually, I think it would be constructive for Ebay to disallow new bidders in the last hour.

Isn't that rather anti-auction behavior? The point of an auction is to get the maximum amount for the item auctioned. The more people involved typically means a higher the price.

Again, we run into the question - What is wrong or unethical about bidding at the last moment (sniping)? Why should one have to give other potential bidders a warning that someone else is also interested in an item?

I hear people objecting to snipping. However not one has given me an ethical reason why it should be eliminated. What harm does it do? All I've noticed is that it effectively eliminates fake bidding to up the price and find out what the active bidders are willing to pay as a maximum (It is really very hard to do successfully in the last 10 seconds of an auction).

[Howell]

I'm not so sure about it being the most effective for objects whose value is not well defined. I think it's most effective for items that don't have a lot of bids. Frankly I like sniping because it eliminates the ability of any other bidders to react to my bid. If I bid $150 early for something on I give everyone a chance to feel me out. They can either decide they are willing to pay more and increase their own bids which does nothing for me but push up the price I end up paying (assuming I still win it).
I'm pretty much immune to getting emotional about ebay purchases, so that's not a big concern to me, but as I mentioned before I like keeping my cards close to the chest until the very end.

It is not difficult to find the going rate for very common items (ie, items that have an auction that ends at least once a day) by watching those auctions and generating a range over a week. The market demand controls what the going rate is if the market is informed and is allowed to work. Even for more rare items they provide a tool on the sellers homepage (http://cgi5.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?SellHub3Visitor) (middle, just below the blue button) but I'm not sure it works as well.

The thing is, sniping only works because other people snipe and typically snipe with a bid just larger than the current bid. If someone bids normally and put in a higher maximum bid then you don't win it. If the system added on 30 sec to the auction then the sniping behavior would change and it would actually work more like RW auction houses.

Yes they can feel you out but they have to commit to buying the item to do so and adds a cost to the probe.

Why do you think it's most effective for items that don't have a lot of bids? Does this include items that don't have a lot of bids but have a lot of watchers? Have you ever been to a real auction? It can be fun to watch other people get into it.

[Fushigi]

Well, for buying some used stuff it's the place to go. For example with used camera equipment you'll get a far better deal on ebay than you will from KEH.
I'd rather pay more to buy from a reputable merchant than take my chances with a service that doesn't give a flying f**k about the integrity of the transactions they broker.

[Howell]

Isn't that rather anti-auction behavior? The point of an auction is to get the maximum amount for the item auctioned. The more people involved typically means a higher the price.

If people were truly interested in the item then they would still participate; I don't think what I'm proposing would reduce the number of participants. I would define "involved" as providing information to the market.



All I've noticed is that it effectively eliminates fake bidding to up the price and find out what the active bidders are willing to pay as a maximum (It is really very hard to do successfully in the last 10 seconds of an auction).

Why do you qualify this behavior as "fake bidding"? All the rules still apply. People are still making commitments with their bids. If you win your own item too many times you are not actually making any money.

Don't get me wrong; if the rules allow it I will make use of them and not feel unprincipled. I'm less interested in the ethics than designing a system that maintains structural integrity. I'm using offline auctions as a standard.

RW auctions do not have a set deadline and would extend the auction time for every bid. In true auctions you don't know what anyone's top dollar is but you do get the chance to react to other bidders and reevaluate whether the new price is worth it. That the bidders have this information keeps the market from breaking. You can probe other bidders in online auctions but you run the risk of getting stuck with the item.

In effect, Ebay acts as a silent auction with open-book bidding. Sniping converts it into closed-book bidding which does not fetch the highest price.

[mubs]

I'd rather pay more to buy from a reputable merchant than take my chances with a service that doesn't give a flying f**k about the integrity of the transactions they broker.
It looks like you and I are in the minority!

[Stereodude]

I'd rather pay more to buy from a reputable merchant than take my chances with a service that doesn't give a flying f**k about the integrity of the transactions they broker.More often then not ebay / paypal sides with the buyer. Paypal is basically worthless when used outside of ebay in terms of buyer protection, but when used inside of ebay it's pretty solid.

[Stereodude]

Why do you qualify this behavior as "fake bidding"? All the rules still apply. People are still making commitments with their bids. If you win your own item too many times you are not actually making any money.I think there's some method that allows for the seller to cancel the last bid of their shill bidder if they should happen to outbid the real bidder. Having not sold on ebay, just bought, I'm not real familiar with the intricacies of selling, but that's what I read.

[Stereodude]

Why do you think it's most effective for items that don't have a lot of bids? Does this include items that don't have a lot of bids but have a lot of watchers?Items that don't have a lot of bids generally have a low price relative to their anticipated market value. This leads to lower bids from other snipers and bidders who think they will get a bargain. This leads to a reasonably valued snipe being much more effective.

For example, a used camera that typically sells for $150'ish on ebay that has 4 hours left and a current price of $50 with 4 bids will be easier to snipe at $150, than one that has 4 hours left with a current price of $130 with 17 bids.

[MaxBurn]

I have never used a sniping service, I like the thrill of throwing in the bid at the last minute myself. Generally though I loose a lot because I put a realistic value on stuff, meaning a hell of a lot lower than msrp as you usually get a less reputable seller (than B&M) no warranty etc. I find far too many loose sight of that and bid right up to and beyond what you can legitimately buy for elsewhere.

As a seller I love sniping, as a buyer it is only a minor disappointment later than earlier when I get outbid or the price moves past what I would pay.

Ebay is totally praying on people and getting them hooked. They are even making it worse now that you can't report negative feedback on a buyer if you are a seller and they don't pay. I reported a non paying bidder through the "proper" new channels they have and completed that process, he never paid, never answered messages and now when I view his account there is NOTHING there to warn other sellers about his past NPB behavior. So now I just delete bids with sellers under ten or so and put in my auction small print that they need to contact me first if under ten. Ebay is playing right into the hands of these crackheads and stringing them along for their auction fix, no way they are going to do anything about it. I fully expect more to be done to support it.

[Howell]

I think there's some method that allows for the seller to cancel the last bid of their shill bidder if they should happen to outbid the real bidder. Having not sold on ebay, just bought, I'm not real familiar with the intricacies of selling, but that's what I read.

But, as far as I know there is no way to tell if an account is a shill bidder.

I've only sold maybe 10-15 items on there and only had one NPB. It is agreed that the system breaks down if there is no enforcement of the rules.

[Howell]

Items that don't have a lot of bids generally have a low price relative to their anticipated market value. This leads to lower bids from other snipers and bidders who think they will get a bargain. This leads to a reasonably valued snipe being much more effective.

For example, a used camera that typically sells for $150'ish on ebay that has 4 hours left and a current price of $50 with 4 bids will be easier to snipe at $150, than one that has 4 hours left with a current price of $130 with 17 bids.

I see. You've found an auction that is being overlooked as far as you can tell. What is your guess on how this situation occurs?

When I see something like that I think people have seen something in the ad that is deterring and I examine it very closely. Sometimes I find that its been posted in the wrong category. Sometimes I find that the picture is not actual and its actually broken in some way.

Don't get me wrong, that's exactly how I got my $80 watch for $64.

[ddrueding]

I used to search for items that were misspelled (primarily magic cards). I stopped buying cars online when everyone started with hidden "reserve" numbers instead of just starting the bidding at what you will accept. That is a bogus practice IMHO.

[MaxBurn]

Stuff that is described wrong, wrong category or a clueless seller is definitely the ebay jackpot.

[Stereodude]

Also people selling multiples of something. Someone selling a lot of 3 of something will typically not sell anywhere near 3x the price of the auctions of 1. If you happen to want multiples or are willing to resell the extras it can be deal time.

[sechs]

I'm pretty much immune to getting emotional about ebay purchases, so that's not a big concern to me, but as I mentioned before I like keeping my cards close to the chest until the very end.So, if you don't get emotional about it, why do you need to hide your bid?

[ddrueding]

So, if you don't get emotional about it, why do you need to hide your bid?

I don't understand how those two are related?

[Stereodude]

I don't understand how those two are related?Nor do I. I want to keep other people from getting emotional about my bid while they still have time to do something about it. Sniping ensures that. :bomb:

[sechs]

So, you're just afraid of being outbid?

[Stereodude]

So, you're just afraid of being outbid?Isn't that a fear of everyone participating in an auction? :alb:

[sechs]

However you want to admit it....

[ddrueding]

How about fear of paying more than you have to...

[sechs]

You mean want to. There's little on eBay that someone really needs.

[udaman]

You mean want to. There's little on eBay that someone really needs.

No, that's a very poor semantic argument. In order to be the winning bidder, you *have* to bid the highest...duh. You *need* to bid the highest in order to be the winning bidder. You *cannot* be successful by "want"ing to be the highest bidder, you must *be* the highest bidder.... again, d'oh!


The fact that there is or is not 'little on ebay that someone really needs' is irrelevant to the discussion.